The Footsteps of Joseph Rock 4/27/2009 11:02
在研究当年Rock在中国西南和中西部的探险资料. 许多的地名和民族名字都对不上中国名字.

请问, 谁知道amne machin 是什么山脉? 我知道在青海省, 是昆仑山脉中的分支. 他探险主要去的俩个山脉之一. 另一个是祁连山脉.

其次, 有一个西藏的少数民族, 叫tebbu, what is this in Chinese? By Rock, there was a Tebbu country in Gansu province in his 1924-1927 expedition. He claimed that "The Tebbu country is par excellence the region of the whole of Kansu", in his april 7th 1926 letter to "Mr. Rehder", whom he is I have no idea.

In Rock's 9/9/26 letter to Sargent: 他认为这里美如伊甸圆.
"I have never in all my life seen such magnificent scenery. If the writer of Genesis had seen the Tebbu country he would have make it the birthplace of Adam and Eve, for besides an endless variety of Conifers there are even Apple trees 40-60 feet tall but the apples are not the kind that would have tempted Eve."

还有, Choni 在甘肃, 不知道中文是什么?
查出来了, 是卓尼在甘肃南部http://agri.com.cn/maps/cmaps/623022.htm
From Rock's letter on April 7 of 1926, we know that he spent his 1925 Christmas alone at the Choni Lamasserie.

Labrang Monastery: 拉卜楞寺 in Xiehe country Gansu province.

Kokonor 好象指青海, 或青海湖 - 这里我一个人于是2001年去过.

Kumbum 就是'塔尔寺", 藏语为"One hundred thousand holy images". - 为藏传佛教格鲁派(俗称黄教)创始人宗喀巴大师的诞生地和藏区黄教六大寺院之一. 我于2001年去看过.

There was war (not clear what it was about) in lower Yangzi in early 1927. So he left Chengdu to Shanghai and arrived Shanghai on May 7th. There were 11 boys he hired in Yunnan followed him for this expedition. He dispatched them so they each had to manage to go back to Yunnan-fu through inland. Once Rock reached Shanghai safely himself, he made his way back to Yunnan-fu to check with his boys arrived safely.

The first director, Charles Sargent, of Arnold Aboretum appointed him the head of this expedition, so most of his correspondene were with Sargent and it was apprent that he grew closer to Sargent with time. But his May 24 of 1927 letter to 'Mr. Wilson' indicated that Dr. Sargent passed away. Rock expressed as "I cannot tell how I feel I am terribly upset about Prof. Sargent's death of which I learned in Hong Kong. There is now no incentive for me to return to America and I have almost decided to go back with my boys into the wilderness probably never to return."

"As I said in all probability I will not return to America if ever. I cannot endure the so called civilized life the very thought of being unable to get back into the wilds with my Nashi boys is sufficient to make me to the same thing that poor Meyer did. I must return. I shall be in Yunnanfu for a month or two to rest up after my strenuous journey of seventy five days from Choni which I left on march 10th. I could not endure the heat in Shanghai and the low altitude."

"So plese tell whoever is in charge at the Arboretum, that I will write fully about my plans after the arrival of my men. I think I ought to be entitled to two months rest after my strenuous trip and verve wraching experiences. If the Arboretm does not think that I am entitled to it I shall say nothing."

看来, 洛克本来想Sargent会对他的将来有安排. 但Sargent突然死亡, 没有留下任何说法. In Rock's 6/29/27 letter also addressed to Wilson, there were sentences like: "I am going to stay here until my men can safely travel. I took it upon myself to see that they reach safely their home in Likiang that is my responsibility. the have served me and Harvard faithfully and my success is due to them in a very great measure." 感动
And then he also said "There is still the possibility of my returning to America but it is very doubtful. I will retreat into the wilds of west China on the Tibetan border, I will throw in my lot among the Nashis of the Tibetan borderland. I hve learned to love then and their wonderful country." 感动

洛克此前一直都是作物收集植物, 鸟类作为他探险的主要任务(和经济来源), 这之后他住在丽江, 开始从事人类学和纳西语言的研究.

http://gutenberg.net.au/


哈, 果然不出所料, 我曾经从植物园知道有另一个物种探险家, Ernest Henry Wilson, 植物园有许多中国的树种是他引进的. 他探险的时间比洛克早.

刚发现, 果然第一任所长27年过世后, 就是由他担任第二任所长. 也就是说洛克写给 Wilson's letters were addressed to him. No wonder Rock asked Wilson in one letter why he didn't write him any letter. 我想他是把洛克当成了自己的竞争对手. 也许, 如果Sargent 没有突然死亡, 会给洛克在哈佛的植物园安排一个工作. 也是为什么洛可问到, whether Sargent had any arrangement for him.

http://www.gardenweb.com/cyberplt/people/wilson.html

这个人我目前所知甚少, 不敢乱言. 但如果我的直觉是对的, 他为免小气了点. 至少他所长也没当长, 30年死于车祸.

It is not hard to see that Rock is a bigger personality than Wilson. My guess is that Wilson probably did not want Rock to be back to Harvard, as a perceived rival.[/quote]

"In China's Border Provinces" by S. B. Sutton

果然, Wilson is about 11 years older than Rock. "He had sustained a nasty injury during an expedition in Szechwan in 1910, which left him with one leg an inch shorter than the other and the feeling he was no longer fit for exploring wilderness areas."

Sargent 高薪将维尔迅请到植物园. 1923 Rock came to Harvard to meet with Sargent to discuss his appointment to lead an expedition to Central China for the Arboretum. Sargent gave him an office and a secretary for him to prepare the trip.

"Rock, ebullient and abosorbed in his preparations, never noticed Wilson's discomfort. Only after serveral months in China, when he longed for news and encouragement from America, did it dawn on him that Wilson never answered his letters. He wondered belatedly if he had said something to offend and begged Sargent to explain, but Sargent sensibly ignored the question."

看来Sargent如果没有过世, 也许也会高薪聘请洛克, 这可能也是他的希望. 但没有发生也好, 我怀疑他能在'文明'的美国生活下去, 他一生restless, and always had to return to Yunnan after short visits in America or Europe, except after 1949, he was not able to return to China.

On August 24, 1949 after he left Lijiang, he wrote to his friend Merrill:
"I will see how things go during the next year and if all is O.K. will go back to Likiang to finish my work, ... I want to die among those beautiful mountains rather than in a bleak hospital bed all alone." 可见他当时还没有意识到共产党的厉害, 直到50年西藏如此边缘的地带也被'解放', 他才知道他喜欢的云南纳西古王国是回不去了.

Rock 可能将纳西文明浪漫化了, 现在的纳西人又将他浪漫化了. 这本书客观无情地剖析洛克这个人和他的经历 (因为他自己留下无数本日记) - 昨天晚上读差点彻底毁灭我已经写出的2500字, 今天早晨又恢复了. 他不完全是我想象的他, 但依旧可以理解他.

不过我必须承认关于Wilson我所知尚少, 回头再研究他.
waterdragonhead at 4/27/2009 11:19 快速引用
waterdragonhead :
http://drjosephrock.blogspot.com/


This is wonderful!

我也在想研究完了, 有没有可能去重复他的路线, 虽然已经是80年以后, 从他的日记通信中看, 许多地方非常危险, 感觉即使是今天, 可能许多地方一个女人也不容易到达.

看来已经有人做了这事. 崇拜

不过, 这个人好象只是去了一些洛克去过的地方, 只是一些地方, 比如甘肃省有许多地方洛克去了.
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 11:29 快速引用
waterdragonhead :
http://drjosephrock.blogspot.com/


waterdragonhead: 你一下子就知道我在讲Joseph Rock, 莫非也对他非常有兴趣?
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 11:46 快速引用
哈, 果然不出所料, 我曾经从植物园知道有另一个物种探险家, Ernest Henry Wilson, 植物园有许多中国的树种是他引进的. 他探险的时间比洛克早.

刚发现, 果然第一任所长27年过世后, 就是由他担任第二任所长. 也就是说洛克写给 Wilson's letters were addressed to him. No wonder Rock asked Wilson in one letter why he didn't write him any letter. 我想他是把洛克当成了自己的竞争对手. 也许, 如果Sargent 没有突然死亡, 会给洛克在哈佛的植物园安排一个工作. 也是为什么洛可问到, whether Sargent had any arrangement for him.

http://www.gardenweb.com/cyberplt/people/wilson.html

这个人我目前所知甚少, 不敢乱言. 但如果我的直觉是对的, 他为免小气了点. 至少他所长也没当长, 30年死于车祸.

It is not hard to see that Rock is a bigger personality than Wilson. My guess is that Wilson probably did not want Rock to be back to Harvard, as a perceived rival.
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 14:07 快速引用
谁帮我猜一下, "艾尔马.D.迈尔"英文名字是什么呢? frustrated
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 14:44 快速引用
做为Rhododendrons的杜鹃花, 虽然植物园里近年来冒出许多种类和颜色, 也有许多是中国品种.

我却失望地发现, 虽然洛克当年作为国家地理协会的探险家收集了许多(23-24年), 在旧金山, DC, 和英国皇家公圆都有, 哈佛植物园竟然没有. (感觉是不是哈佛的骄傲导致, 当时分发给许多公圆. 哈佛难道就没有要吗? 随国家地理之后, 哈佛就派洛克去中国中部去收集 - 目的是探索一个处女地.)
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 16:06 快速引用
Not in particular,

There was a PBS show called "The First Flower" that talked about him.


wildcrane :
waterdragonhead :
http://drjosephrock.blogspot.com/


waterdragonhead: 你一下子就知道我在讲Joseph Rock, 莫非也对他非常有兴趣?
waterdragonhead at 4/27/2009 16:18 快速引用
上次听你说了,我回去google 了下。搜到这个link.


“J. (Joseph) F. Rock● 美国学者,其采集活动包括:
①1920年到缅甸、泰国,珠转到云南蒙自、河口、红河、维西、景洪、澜沧、东川、丽江、大理、中甸、德钦、勐海采集植物标本;②1922年沿瑞怒分水岭-丽江-腾冲采集;③1923年从丽江途经立地坪-维西-菖蒲桶-白马山-察瓦龙-怒江以西-到怒澜分水岭龙日(坝)Londje采集;④1924年从木里经四川到甘肃采集;⑤1925年到卓尼途经叠布(Tebbu)-青海湖-阿尼马卿山-南山(即祁连山)采集;⑥1926年夏秋间在下叠布(Lower Tebbu-land)采集;⑦1928年到康定、巴塘采集。5次采集到大量标本,包括多数新种,如距瓣尾囊
pbxmeis at 4/27/2009 17:44 快速引用
pbxmeis :
上次听你说了,我回去google 了下。搜到这个link.


“J. (Joseph) F. Rock● 美国学者,其采集活动包括:
①1920年到缅甸、泰国,珠转到云南蒙自、河口、红河、维西、景洪、澜沧、东川、丽江、大理、中甸、德钦、勐海采集植物标本;②1922年沿瑞怒分水岭-丽江-腾冲采集;③1923年从丽江途经立地坪-维西-菖蒲桶-白马山-察瓦龙-怒江以西-到怒澜分水岭龙日(坝)Londje采集;④1924年从木里经四川到甘肃采集;⑤1925年到卓尼途经叠布(Tebbu)-青海湖-阿尼马卿山-南山(即祁连山)采集;⑥1926年夏秋间在下叠布(Lower Tebbu-land)采集;⑦1928年到康定、巴塘采集。5次采集到大量标本,包括多数新种,如距瓣尾囊
wildcrane at 4/27/2009 18:01 快速引用
wildcrane :
哈, 果然不出所料, 我曾经从植物园知道有另一个物种探险家, Ernest Henry Wilson, 植物园有许多中国的树种是他引进的. 他探险的时间比洛克早.

刚发现, 果然第一任所长27年过世后, 就是由他担任第二任所长. 也就是说洛克写给 Wilson's letters were addressed to him. No wonder Rock asked Wilson in one letter why he didn't write him any letter. 我想他是把洛克当成了自己的竞争对手. 也许, 如果Sargent 没有突然死亡, 会给洛克在哈佛的植物园安排一个工作. 也是为什么洛可问到, whether Sargent had any arrangement for him.

http://www.gardenweb.com/cyberplt/people/wilson.html

这个人我目前所知甚少, 不敢乱言. 但如果我的直觉是对的, 他为免小气了点. 至少他所长也没当长, 30年死于车祸.

It is not hard to see that Rock is a bigger personality than Wilson. My guess is that Wilson probably did not want Rock to be back to Harvard, as a perceived rival.


"In China's Border Provinces" by S. B. Sutton

果然, Wilson is about 11 years older than Rock. "He had sustained a nasty injury during an expedition in Szechwan in 1910, which left him with one leg an inch shorter than the other and the feeling he was no longer fit for exploring wilderness areas."

Sargent 高薪将维尔迅请到植物园. 1923 Rock came to Harvard to meet with Sargent to discuss his appointment to lead an expedition to Central China for the Arboretum. Sargent gave him an office and a secretary for him to prepare the trip.

"Rock, ebullient and abosorbed in his preparations, never noticed Wilson's discomfort. Only after serveral months in China, when he longed for news and encouragement from America, did it dawn on him that Wilson never answered his letters. He wondered belatedly if he had said something to offend and begged Sargent to explain, but Sargent sensibly ignored the question."

看来Sargent如果没有过世, 也许也会高薪聘请洛克, 这可能也是他的希望. 但没有发生也好, 我怀疑他能在'文明'的美国生活下去, 他一生restless, and always had to return to Yunnan after short visits in America or Europe, except after 1949, he was not able to return to China.

On August 24, 1949 after he left Lijiang, he wrote to his friend Merrill:
"I will see how things go during the next year and if all is O.K. will go back to Likiang to finish my work, ... I want to die among those beautiful mountains rather than in a bleak hospital bed all alone." 可见他当时还没有意识到共产党的厉害, 直到50年西藏如此边缘的地带也被'解放', 他才知道他喜欢的云南纳西古王国是回不去了.

Rock 可能将纳西文明浪漫化了, 现在的纳西人又将他浪漫化了. 这本书客观无情地剖析洛克这个人和他的经历 (因为他自己留下无数本日记) - 昨天晚上读差点彻底毁灭我已经写出的2500字, 今天早晨又恢复了. 他不完全是我想象的他, 但依旧可以理解他.

不过我必须承认关于Wilson我所知尚少, 回头再研究他.
wildcrane at 5/05/2009 11:50 快速引用
哼, 查雪菘村竟然查到自己从前的日记本里. 可见我第二次去丽江的时候已经知道洛克在这里住过. 看来第二次去太失望了, 当时看见俩次的变化非常忧郁, 哪里都没有去, 竟然也没去看看这个村子.
http://www.shenghuonet.com/blog/blogtopic.php?t=23658
wildcrane at 5/05/2009 14:45 快速引用
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