<What the U.S. Can Learn from China>
Book by Ann Lee:
http://professorannlee.com/
Just found her most recent speech:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXunISvhdd
"While America is still reeling from the 2008 financial crisis, a high unemployment rate, and a surge in government debt, China’s economy is the second largest in the world and many predict will surpass the U.S. by 2020. President Obama called China’s rise “a Sputnik moment”—will America seize this moment or continue to treat China as its scapegoat?
Many in mainstream media and in the U.S.government regularly target China as a threat. Rather than viewing China’s power, influence, and contributions to the global economy in a negative light, Ann Lee asks: What can America learn from its competition? Why did China suffer so little from the global economic meltdown? What accounts for China’s extraordinary growth, despite one of the highest corporate tax rates in the world? How does the Chinese political system avoid partisan rancor but achieve genuine public accountability? From education to governance to foreign aid, Lee details the policies and practices that have made China a global power and then isolates the ways the U.S. can use China’s enduring principles to foster much-needed change at home"
What the U.S. Can Learn from China 2/22/2012 19:28
作者是华裔NYU 教授,北大客坐教授,银行家...
偶尔在C-SPAN 听到作者的演讲,感到她的观点很有启发.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhKPbrlVMRA
http://www.firstbusinessnews.com/videos.php?video=fb009785fa724563affba5c361708cc3
偶尔在C-SPAN 听到作者的演讲,感到她的观点很有启发.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhKPbrlVMRA
http://www.firstbusinessnews.com/videos.php?video=fb009785fa724563affba5c361708cc3
interesting!
Key points about the book:
• Lays out what America can gain by studying China’s approach to politics, economics, finance, education, foreign policy and more
• Author Ann Lee has experience on both sides of the Pacific—she has taught in China and worked on Wall Street
• Counters the trend of demonizing China by offering a rare nuanced view of how Chinese society actually works
更有趣的是Ann Lee 认为中国中央政府官员虽不是选举上台,但是经过考核层层选拔上台的,又往往在不同省轮换,有丰富的执政经验,就像美国大公司的CEO,而CEO 是无需选举上台的。可美国政府官员往往无考核和少地方执政经验,多选举经验。且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。
• Lays out what America can gain by studying China’s approach to politics, economics, finance, education, foreign policy and more
• Author Ann Lee has experience on both sides of the Pacific—she has taught in China and worked on Wall Street
• Counters the trend of demonizing China by offering a rare nuanced view of how Chinese society actually works
更有趣的是Ann Lee 认为中国中央政府官员虽不是选举上台,但是经过考核层层选拔上台的,又往往在不同省轮换,有丰富的执政经验,就像美国大公司的CEO,而CEO 是无需选举上台的。可美国政府官员往往无考核和少地方执政经验,多选举经验。且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。
xqh05 : |
Key points about the book:
• Lays out what America can gain by studying China’s approach to politics, economics, finance, education, foreign policy and more • Author Ann Lee has experience on both sides of the Pacific—she has taught in China and worked on Wall Street • Counters the trend of demonizing China by offering a rare nuanced view of how Chinese society actually works 更有趣的是Ann Lee 认为中国中央政府官员虽不是选举上台,但是经过考核层层选拔上台的,又往往在不同省轮换,有丰富的执政经验,就像美国大公司的CEO,而CEO 是无需选举上台的。可美国政府官员往往无考核和少地方执政经验,多选举经验。且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。 |
是啊,中国选能人,美国选的是嘴皮子牛人。
而且中国政府更迎合民意,更代表民意。美国政府更代表钱意。
了因 : | ||
是啊,中国选能人,美国选的是嘴皮子牛人。 而且中国政府更迎合民意,更代表民意。美国政府更代表钱意。 |
That's very very true. 中国能人 all go back to or stay in China. Fortunately Most of Useless 嘴皮子 Chinese people stay in America. No wonder China is getting stronger and better.


了因 : |
是啊,中国选能人 |
对
不过选的是关系能人
不一定是管理能人
xqh05 : |
且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。 |
我到觉得不一定
互联网这种长远利益的就是美政府搞定
Himalaya : | ||||
That's very very true. 中国能人 all go back to or stay in China. Fortunately Most of Useless 嘴皮子 Chinese people stay in America. No wonder China is getting stronger and better. ![]() ![]() |
你也不含糊啊?这是鸠摩智的火焰刀吗?厉害。
Does this thought ever occur to you: Maybe both US and China are ruled by the same group of super-elites. They assign agents to each country, and play the "people" with s*(*lism or demacrocy based on the mental inclinition of the ruled party at the moment.
When people think because Americans are ruling american but Chinese are ruling Chinese therefore the hypothesis above is ridiculous, maybe that's because there is racism still hidden deep in the minds.
Just a thought.
When people think because Americans are ruling american but Chinese are ruling Chinese therefore the hypothesis above is ridiculous, maybe that's because there is racism still hidden deep in the minds.
Just a thought.
xiaoqiang : |
Does this thought ever occur to you: Maybe both US and China are ruled by the same group of super-elites. They assign agents to each country, and play the "people" with s*(*lism or demacrocy based on the mental inclinition of the ruled party at the moment.
When people think because Americans are ruling american but Chinese are ruling Chinese therefore the hypothesis above is ridiculous, maybe that's because there is racism still hidden deep in the minds. Just a thought. |
就这个趋势,但不是阴谋论。是自然形成的,相关利益绑定。
xiaoqiang : |
Does this thought ever occur to you: Maybe both US and China are ruled by the same group of super-elites. They assign agents to each country, and play the "people" with s*(*lism or demacrocy based on the mental inclinition of the ruled party at the moment.
When people think because Americans are ruling american but Chinese are ruling Chinese therefore the hypothesis above is ridiculous, maybe that's because there is racism still hidden deep in the minds. Just a thought. |
That thought does occur to me sometimes.
Just think about the beneficiaries of Globalization and so-called global firms.
They are the same group of super-elites.
xqh05 : |
Key points about the book:
• Lays out what America can gain by studying China’s approach to politics, economics, finance, education, foreign policy and more • Author Ann Lee has experience on both sides of the Pacific—she has taught in China and worked on Wall Street • Counters the trend of demonizing China by offering a rare nuanced view of how Chinese society actually works 更有趣的是Ann Lee 认为中国中央政府官员虽不是选举上台,但是经过考核层层选拔上台的,又往往在不同省轮换,有丰富的执政经验,就像美国大公司的CEO,而CEO 是无需选举上台的。可美国政府官员往往无考核和少地方执政经验,多选举经验。且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。 |
这里的根本问题,是私企本身和政府的根本区别:私企是人们可以选择和逃避的,你不喜欢某私企,你甚至可以自己成立一个和它竞争。私企只涉及部分人和部分利益。但对政府没有这个可能,政府与每个人都有关,你逃不了也无法再建一个政府去竞争。即使革命推翻政府,也跟逃离私企不一样,你逃离私企,别人还可以选择不逃离;你推翻了政府,其他人也跟着必须选择新政府。
所以把私企CEO的选择模式推广到政府领导的选择是不完全合适的。政府领导的选择过程,必须与所有民众有公开的交流沟通和认可过程,这个过程如果不是竞选,似乎还没人能提出另外一个可替代的过程出来。
Ann Lee说的考核和选拔比起个人指定和家族继承来说,当然是进步了许多,但它毕竟还不是公开的和民众的交流沟通和认可的过程。有没有可能把这个考核和选拔进一步改革成公开的和民众的交流沟通和认可的过程呢?当然是可能的,不过,如果做到了这一步,那跟竞选就区别不太大了。
美国大概没有可能去学中国这个特点,因为美国的竞选已经包括了这种考核和选拔。美国最应该学中国什么呢,当然就是学中国人多吃点,吃好点了。
了因这个CEO的提法是不是抄袭你的创意啊,可惜可惜,你也没去申请个专利什么的。
xqh05 : |
Key points about the book:
• Lays out what America can gain by studying China’s approach to politics, economics, finance, education, foreign policy and more • Author Ann Lee has experience on both sides of the Pacific—she has taught in China and worked on Wall Street • Counters the trend of demonizing China by offering a rare nuanced view of how Chinese society actually works 更有趣的是Ann Lee 认为中国中央政府官员虽不是选举上台,但是经过考核层层选拔上台的,又往往在不同省轮换,有丰富的执政经验,就像美国大公司的CEO,而CEO 是无需选举上台的。可美国政府官员往往无考核和少地方执政经验,多选举经验。且执政多考量选民和捐款者利益,少国家长远和整体利益。 |
Ann Lee 讲道中国有五年计划,十年计划,要落实到各级政府督促检查。而美国政府就不大容易做到。总统可能有4年计划,4年后被选下台,可能计划也要换。
tutu : | ||
我到觉得不一定 互联网这种长远利益的就是美政府搞定 |
xqh05 : | ||||
Ann Lee 讲道中国有五年计划,十年计划,要落实到各级政府督促检查。而美国政府就不大容易做到。总统可能有4年计划,4年后被选下台,可能计划也要换。
|
这种五年计划在中央集权式的社会和经济发展初中期比较容易制定和实施,在美国这种由下至上推动发展的社会根本不可行的。就像黑人运动,妇女解放,同性婚姻不是白宫开个会,发个政策就行的。美国的各级政府是没有上下级关系的。
了因哪里提到CEO了?现在申请专利还来得及吗?

MorningMoon : | ||
了因这个CEO的提法是不是抄袭你的创意啊,可惜可惜,你也没去申请个专利什么的。
|
CEO这理论是了因(以前叫Wojian)的绝杀武器之一,一遇到和人争论民主的时候就会拿出来,好几个人就这个问题和了因争论过,反正"文无第一,武无第二",了因从来没有认输过,从此自命"独孤求败"。我考古了半天,终于找到一段。
http://www.shenghuonet.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=50980&start=75
http://www.shenghuonet.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=50980&start=75
WoJian : |
很高兴你的情绪和态度得到了很大的缓和。
我这段话,并不是新的立论。我写下这段话,是帮助你理解我以前说过的所有的回帖的。你以这种视角,去回头再看我以前的帖,就能找到你现在在问的这些问题的答案了。我有的时候说管好这个家,有的时候说管好这个村,其实是一个含义的,都是说有着内部管理的矛盾需要处理,也有着外部打交道的矛盾需要处理。而轻重缓急,是我辩论中的关键的关键,不是你以前理解的我在东拉西扯打游击。 所以以前你讨论的大部分论点,很多我都以不是当前该关注的主要角度来回答了。不是说你次要问题考虑得不对,而是说你把次要问题放到主要位置上来,压制了领导对主要矛盾的关注力了。完全之策并不存在,你做backseat driver,生硬地以别的司机的方式来压你车上的司机要照搬,忽略了这辆车另外所面临的主要问题,是别的车上所不存在的。村与村的情况不同,念的经就是该不同的。 我们其实存在共同的关心点的,也就是双方都同意现在急需解决和面对的问题,是中国内部正在形成的削弱中央领导力量的黑白道小利益集团问题,和地方势力大到不受控制的问题。而围绕这些关键的内部问题,结合在国际上争取到最大利益这个大方向大目标,你以为让民众有更多的话语权是加强中央力量的方法,我以台湾苏联等例子,已经告诉了你,这样会走更多的弯路,经受更多的苦难。民众会被误导,就象台湾的例子,你强调了台独是影响台湾经济的根源,但选打着台独口号的陈水扁,不就是民众的选择吗?民众如果足够聪明,如果能有全局观念,就该看到经济上要受损失呀。民主的好处,是受难后纠错(也是一错再错以后才纠正的,没有在第一时间就纠正),但民主的坏处就是没有能在事前就得到正确判断。民众也会找不到方向,就象俄国一样的,最后还是找到铁腕来解决问题,那当初早知道干什么去了呀。所以民众没有足够的知识能力,对管理和整体感的理解和智力程度去评判,去管好与别的村子打好交道这种条件和要求,与在内部如何管理协调好各种利益,需要什么样的总经理是最好的。而董事会有很好的背景可以做出更好的选择。但我说群众没有能力选择,并没有说群众就没有权力参与在选择的过程当中。人民代表大会需要投票通过这一步,就是群众对董事会选总经理的监督步骤。中国的文革,从我们这个论题的角度去看,可以认为是个放手让群众去管领导的实践。那么领导不去干坏事是管好了,黑白道问题和地方势力的问题都得到了很好的解决了(顺便说一下,连世界上普遍存在的妓女问题也被彻底清除,我认为是件让我惊讶的事情)。但群众在选什么样领导才能对建设和管理更好的方面,你看出了群众的才能了吗?你看出了群众对轻重缓急的大方向需要把握好的理解了吗?你看出了群众鉴别领导把握全局的才能的能力了吗?真是可惜,没有啊。群众现在的水平,美国也是一样的,群众盯着的,就是眼前的利益,芝麻蒜皮的事情。在前面的帖子中,我说了职员对总裁的评判标准的例子,现在我进一步说,美国的钢铁工会,对政府的政策的推动,是长远地考虑了美国的利益了吗?还是主要考虑的是工会会员现在的收入? 所以管好领导不去干坏事是你的关注点,放到选好什么样的领导才能对建设和发展更好一起,让群众去选这方法就排除了,用董事会去选就是更好的方式,然后另想主意该怎么监督领导不去干坏事。顺便说一下,不存在能连领导个案干坏事都能防止的政体。能做到领导干坏事不普及化,不影响国家的发展,就够好的了。我谈过了美国腐败的问题,就是想让你看到这点。我认为美国的腐败问题存在的程度也挺大,但真正需要解决的是金融政策上的偏向个别利益集团的大腐败问题,细节上的很多腐败个案,还没有提高到影响国家发展方向的这个急需解决的高度上来,只需要偶尔杀鸡儆猴,别让腐败个案变成相互学样的普及化就可以了。 |
xqh05 : | ||
了因哪里提到CEO了?现在申请专利还来得及吗? ![]()
|
谢谢晨月,这古董都挖出来了,当然知道生活网的名笔吾见。看来只能说英雄所见略同了。
MorningMoon : | ||||||
CEO这理论是了因(以前叫Wojian)的绝杀武器之一,一遇到和人争论民主的时候就会拿出来,好几个人就这个问题和了因争论过,反正"文无第一,武无第二",了因从来没有认输过,从此自命"独孤求败"。我考古了半天,终于找到一段。
http://www.shenghuonet.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=50980&start=75
|
了因 : | ||
是啊,中国选能人,美国选的是嘴皮子牛人。 而且中国政府更迎合民意,更代表民意。美国政府更代表钱意。 |
说中国政府更代表民意,第四个代表嘛?

( “三个代表”的内容是:中国共产党必须始终代表中国先进生产力的发展要求,代表中国先进文化的前进方向,代表中国最广大人民的根本利益。 )
sometime I think American is great:好来坞演员当州长,总统的事是绝不可能在中国发生的。
Three laws of robotics:
1. A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Laws.
A lot of contradictions can be derived from such simple laws.
1. A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Laws.
A lot of contradictions can be derived from such simple laws.